Oak Creek WI P 50

[Greg]

That siren was still in great shape. The baseball park was the 2nd location for that siren head. When the Oak Creek Police department was on Howell Ave the siren was located on that property. When the police department moved to Ryan Road about 7 or 8 years ago this siren was relocated because they did not want to have it on private property. I am sure it was partially updated when it was moved because it continued to rotate on the wind down unlike most of the other P 50's. Oak Creek has 3 sirens (all were P-50s) The siren located on East Ryan Road failed a test last year because it was not rotating. It was quickly replaced with what I believe to be a T-135 ac/dc. The city said lets replace all of them before they fail even though the other 2 would most likely continue to work just fine for years to come. As you can see from the pictures that siren didn't even have any holes in the fiberglass horn. The other siren on Ryan and Howell was replaced today. I seen the old P-50 loaded on a trailer as the electrician were still wiring up the new one. It looked to be in the same condition as the one pictured.

[Archon]

here is the New T-132 and it's power is not turned on yet

[4J25]

Sorry to be correcting you, (You probably just made a typo ) it's actually a T-135.

[TboltTX1]

Sorry to be correcting you, (You probably just made a typo ) it's actually a T-135.

Probably not a typo. Although these sirens are labeled as "T-135s" they only put out 132 Db @100 ft. That is why there really is no suitable replacement for P-50s and why I personally see no reason to replace working ones. I would trade battery backup for a siren that has the effective range of four smaller ones.

[BadgerSiren]

I would trade battery backup for a siren that has the effective range of four smaller ones.

I wouldn't, not ever. A siren's range is just so variable anyway, and the unit is useless when the power goes out, as it often does during tornadic thunderstorms. Battery backup is an absolute necessity. Far too many lives have been endangered or lost because of non-functional warning systems.

Besides, there are plenty of other good reasons to replace an aging siren. P-50s use an extreme amount of energy for a siren—480V if I'm not mistaken?

[uncommonsense]

The T-135 is a more efficient design that yields similar results to the P-50 in terms of overall dispersion. Remember, decibel output in no way tells the whole story. Let me direct you to this thread from when the new T-135 debuted where a few experts noted their experiences with field tests:

https://airraidsirens.com/forums/viewto ... ?f=2&t=707

In particular, note:

Yes, it's true. The T-132 is here. The first unit is installed and just finished testing last tuesday for it's approval by FEMA/Homeland Security.

The siren output is slightly lower @ 100' but it's the single tone frequency of 500 hz versus the two-tone output of the P-50 that makes the difference at the 2 mile mark. The T-132 siren will be a direct replacement of the P-50 (T-135).

The siren is a beefed up version of the T-128 running with 6-group 31 batteries in series for 72VDC battery backup and a AC Rectifier for its primary power.

The P-50 siren was too limited to where it could be installed due to the 3 phase 200A power requirement and could not be battery backed up. I have however put on on generator back-up with a soft start contactor running at 480V. The P-50 is a monster but a maintenance headache with the broken screens and fiberglass deterioration on the huge horn. It had a good run but needed to be replaced with a more practical siren.

--SirenTech

And also:

The TM-132 (I think the TM stand for "The Monster") is a T-128 on steroids. For the test that the last gentleman was referring to, we got 85 dB at one mile and about 74 dB at two miles - cross wind and flat ground. Ain't no P-50/T-135-AC that can do that.

For the reasons explained above, it has a longer range than a T-135-AC - which only tested at 132.5 dB at 100 feet, by the way. The Monster tested at ~133 dB at 100 feet in AC mode and ~132 dB at 100 feet operating on batteries. It was quite impressive to be up in the bucket truck about 100 feet out in front of this thing while it sounded - even with jet mechanic ear muffs it still knocks your hair back.

The Monster does with a 20-HP motor what it took a 50-HP motor to do. This one will be an instant favorite of siren lovers everywhere. You guys in Northern Illinois should start looking for them in the EPZs of a nuclear plant near you. They will be going up over the next two years. One is already installed near Joliet - it's replacing a T-bolt.

(P.S. The T-132 is a name that it went by before its intro as proved by a too-early update to ASC's website. The siren's name IS T-135. You'll note now the T-1XX doesn't reflect much of anything now as ASC claims 132/133 for the T-135 and 130 for the T-128 in their literature).

[holler]

I wouldn't, not ever. A siren's range is just so variable anyway, and the unit is useless when the power goes out, as it often does during tornadic thunderstorms. Battery backup is an absolute necessity. Far too many lives have been endangered or lost because of non-functional warning systems.

Besides, there are plenty of other good reasons to replace an aging siren. P-50s use an extreme amount of energy for a siren—480V if I'm not mistaken?

480V is nothing, you have 7400-14,000 volts on the distribution lines before it gets stepped down to whatever voltage you choose. It's the amperage that gets you. Power companies don't like it when you start a 50 horse motor across the line with a high inertia load. It makes all the lights on the line dim for about a mile due to the inrush.

A DC siren is nice, but the initial cost is very high and they cost more to maintain and have more to go wrong than the old AC sirens. You can't get more reliable than an omnidirectional three phase siren. We get more repair calls on DC sirens than the old AC ones, with the majority of the calls on the AC sirens being control related failures from power surges and lack of surge protection. Plus a large percentage of AC/DC sirens are not properly maintained and wouldn't work in the event of a power outage anyway. The only ones that let you know something is wrong is a DC only siren or a two way system.

At least they didn't replace it with a 2001-130.

[Bryan]

The whole concept of mechanical sirens running off battery power has its draw backs. Like Jeb said theres more to go wrong with these newer battery backup sirens, instead of one means of power now you have two. Your controls are more complicated, and lend themselves to being more prone to issues. Federal complicates things even more by having an AC powered FC control/run a DC powered siren...which is working out oh so well for federal. My T-128 is way more complicated than the old AC only sirens. On a mechanical siren the battery backup is not really going to last, typically when you drain a battery that fast after its been sitting idol for a long period the battery has a cell go dead then it has to be replaced. You really have to keep on your maintenance on the newer sirens, they don't behave like they should...

[uncommonsense]

Federal complicates things even more by having an AC powered FC control/run a DC powered siren...which is working out oh so well for federal.

You can't be serious...

[holler]

He's right, the board runs on AC along with the battery chargers until the lights go out, then it switches over to DC. I wish they would run the board off DC all the time to help protect it from all the crap that comes in on the power lines. Those batteries act as big smoothing capacitors.

Whelen runs the controls and the entire siren off DC 24/7. It helps the controls to live longer, happier lives since they aren't getting hit with spikes and dips from the AC service. The batteries absorb the ripples and smooth things out.