the CICCA siren rabbit hole

[Dorianelevator]

i am a french siren enthusiast, and the first siren i ever saw was this one : https://www.google.fr/maps/@43.5585476, ... ?entry=ttu (I DID NOT DOXX MYSELF, I DO NOT LIVE IN THAT TOWN ANYMORE.), at the time i did not know french sirens were not us sirens, so i called it a STL-10 (LMAO), but now, i know it is a very rare CICCA siren with short horns and no bevel gear motor. it sadly is inactive. then when i searched more about CICCA sirens, it just kept on going. and the entire CICCA sirens thing turned into a rabbit hole. and just one thing, yes i do know the big french sirens brand like Construction Electrique Du Nord but we are talking about CICCA here. and i only found very limited information about them : i found a video of a bevel gear one from British Pathé but thats all, and the worst part is that he also reuploaded it with a diffrent name. there is also that one in Brazil but that is a 8 horn one, and all of these have the big horns, not small horns, then theres this : https://www.leboncoin.fr/bricolage/1951877132.htm wait what, its a 4 horn ??? the rabbit hole gets deeper, and why does he sell it with a 220v to 24v converter, does it run on 24v ??????? then https://www.leboncoin.fr/decoration/2490243079.htm OH MY GOD IT GETS DEEPER. i cant belive it. and somehow we still do not know what the 6 horn one sounds like, nor the 4 horn. we only know what the big 8 horn bevel gear one sounds like thanks to that brazil siren that sounds daily. but now its time for the reason i made this, do you guys have more information about CICCA sirens ? i will appreciate any information about them.

[Darley Champion]

I don't know if that help, but one of my friends (who is unfortunately unreachable due to some "complications" that I won't get into further details) has a much later CICCA 1kW siren. According to the guy who my friend bought it from, this particular unit was installed in Paris and subsequently taken out of service.

It does not have any distinguishable features besides that like a Finsécur KMEurop (now KM-Sécur) it's upside down with the rotor opening being on the bottom, but unlike the KMEurops/KM-Secur units, the cage is smaller and the "core" is thicker.

About that 4-horned siren: I believe this may be a CHOLET siren, based on other sirens that I've seen in a group chat (I'm not at liberty of posting pictures, however). It's wholly unconfirmed but if I get more info I'll do my best to forward it.

The second Cicca siren, I've been negociating with the seller to potentially buy it, but I've yet to hear back anything from him/her (though due to the logistical nightmare that this will be, I'm probably not going to pursue this further).

By the way, add another brand to the list: PTR-Delta. Those generally have a small "hat" but without the octogonal or hexagonal crown armature that larger PTR sirens have. I don't have any info on these but a person I know has dug up something about this company being located in Lyon.

Edit: Scratch that. Those two sirens both appear to be late CHOLET sirens sold under Cicca's umbrella.

The second one at least sounds like what a Federal Electric Model 1 would sound on 50Hz.

Edit 2: There's a connection between Cicca and Cholet (Chollet?) that I dug up last year... Unfortunately I can no longer find any of the pages I had saved.. But I found this: https://archives.cholet.fr/regards-sur- ... -de-cholet

[Dorianelevator]

I don't know if that help, but one of my friends (who is unfortunately unreachable due to some "complications" that I won't get into further details) has a much later CICCA 1kW siren. According to the guy who my friend bought it from, this particular unit was installed in Paris and subsequently taken out of service.

It does not have any distinguishable features besides that like a Finsécur KMEurop (now KM-Sécur) it's upside down with the rotor opening being on the bottom, but unlike the KMEurops/KM-Secur units, the cage is smaller and the "core" is thicker.

About that 4-horned siren: I believe this may be a CHOLET siren, based on other sirens that I've seen in a group chat (I'm not at liberty of posting pictures, however). It's wholly unconfirmed but if I get more info I'll do my best to forward it.

The second Cicca siren, I've been negociating with the seller to potentially buy it, but I've yet to hear back anything from him/her (though due to the logistical nightmare that this will be, I'm probably not going to pursue this further).

By the way, add another brand to the list: PTR-Delta. Those generally have a small "hat" but without the octogonal or hexagonal crown armature that larger PTR sirens have. I don't have any info on these but a person I know has dug up something about this company being located in Lyon.

Edit: Scratch that. Those two sirens both appear to be late CHOLET sirens sold under Cicca's umbrella.

The second one at least sounds like what a Federal Electric Model 1 would sound on 50Hz.

Edit 2: There's a connection between Cicca and Cholet (Chollet?) that I dug up last year... Unfortunately I can no longer find any of the pages I had saved.. But I found this: https://archives.cholet.fr/regards-sur- ... -de-cholet

i already knew about the PTR delta sirens, i even saw one on sale on leboncoin : https://www.leboncoin.fr/collection/2378466517.htm
for the second CICCA siren, julien boller (biggest french siren guy and also my friend) is also trying to buy it.
apart from that thanks for the information and now i know that these are rebranded CHOLET sirens, yet another brand to talk about. time to see how deep the rabbit hole gets... also for the CICCA 1kW siren, that is similar to CEN sa you said, is it the same as this one : https://www.google.fr/maps/place/Mairie ... ?entry=ttu ? (it has been modernised by a Pakita LC so it no longer exists) anyways also telling you but i am going to buy a later Demay R3P siren from the 1940s, it also has the rotor opening on the bottom and has the uncommon 2850rpm instead of 3000rpm. the Demay R3P usually also came with horns, but mine does not have them. tho, one more question, is the first siren (the one in Barjols in the first link) a CHOLET or a CICCA ?
EDIT : oh and yes, i saw both of your edits, so this is why i have this here, to tell you that i saw them.

[Darley Champion]

Couldn't tell for sure. It does look very Cholet-esque...

Also I got some unfortunate news, I went to look for my friend's Cicca siren, and unfortunately we couldn't find it... Not sure what happened to it.

As for the Verneuil-en-Halatte siren, I do not think it was replaced (if it did... That really sucks... Do you have proof it was replaced?), but rather I don't think it's a CEN or DELTA siren (or was). Might be something even more obscure. (edit: yeah it was replaced, grrrr)

My hometown (Gouvieux) had an identical siren to the Verneuil one, at some point, although it was a bit taller, unfortunately it was replaced in the early 80's or 90's by a KMEurop 1kW block that was disconnected (long story short, the control box was ripped apart)..


I'm really sad that they scrapped the Verneuil siren... I took a picture of this one many years ago, said picture ended up in one of SLATE's articles recently.. Sigh..

[Darley Champion]

Also, you won't find much about Chollet, I tried, and did find a page, but it was hosted on the Orange pages perso service that was... Nuked out of existence..

Probably not what you'd wanted to hear but alas...

I'm myself trying to buy a Klaxon SO-4 siren, due to you know, space constraints (not to mention, my bad back and truckload of muscular issues basically prevents me from even trying to lift anything heavy).. I wish I could obtain the Champagne-sur-Oise siren that sits on the site of the former EDF Coal-fired power plant... But even if I could, my body would just "nope" out of that, full stop. I struggled to lift my friend's CICCA siren (barely could get it off the ground).. Maybe someday, I'd do the impossible and import a Federal Signal Model 2-240, sky's the limit after all!

There's also Ully-saint-Georges that has a CEN siren, but without horns and a smaller motor, and Cinqueux that has an as of yet unidentified siren, I believe Julien may have told me that it was a PTR but to me I don't think it is. I've seen it from a distance and could see that it had a "crown" but it was perfectly circular with spikes on the posts.. Ninja edit: Looked on StreetView, I think I may have confused the "crown" with the antennas around the siren! (though it does look like the old Verneuil siren.. But with longer horns)

It did look like the later Cicca siren that my friend had with just an armature bolted on top.

[Dorianelevator]

Also, you won't find much about Chollet, I tried, and did find a page, but it was hosted on the Orange pages perso service that was... Nuked out of existence..

Probably not what you'd wanted to hear but alas...

I'm myself trying to buy a Klaxon SO-4 siren, due to you know, space constraints (not to mention, my bad back and truckload of muscular issues basically prevents me from even trying to lift anything heavy).. I wish I could obtain the Champagne-sur-Oise siren that sits on the site of the former EDF Coal-fired power plant... But even if I could, my body would just "nope" out of that, full stop. I struggled to lift my friend's CICCA siren (barely could get it off the ground).. Maybe someday, I'd do the impossible and import a Federal Signal Model 2-240, sky's the limit after all!

There's also Ully-saint-Georges that has a CEN siren, but without horns and a smaller motor, and Cinqueux that has an as of yet unidentified siren, I believe Julien may have told me that it was a PTR but to me I don't think it is. I've seen it from a distance and could see that it had a "crown" but it was perfectly circular with spikes on the posts.. Ninja edit: Looked on StreetView, I think I may have confused the "crown" with the antennas around the siren! (though it does look like the old Verneuil siren.. But with longer horns)

It did look like the later Cicca siren that my friend had with just an armature bolted on top.

for the CEN siren, is it the same as in Régusse (once again i dont live there, but im gonna film it this month) ? the one in Régusse looks like this : https://www.google.fr/maps/@43.6563143, ... ?entry=ttu anyways, that Cinqueux siren really looks like a PTR with short horns but im not sure... also i found it on street view : https://www.google.fr/maps/@49.319285,2 ... ?entry=ttu, apart from that, i have another weird one, that being the siren in Entrecasteaux (also gonna film it this month but i dont live there), weirdly, it tests on fridays instead of wednesdays, still tests at noon tho. anyways i am going to buy Demay R3P siren soon but apart from that, i found a SO4 for you , its here : https://www.leboncoin.fr/bricolage/2490594457.htm, anyways last month i saw a CEN NP3S siren on sale on leboncoin, sadly someone bought it. but if it was still up i would have given the link to you. anyways the Entrecasteaux is just a regular CEN apart from the fact it tests on a diffrent day. now thats kind of all. and since the Entrecasteaux siren does not test on the same day as most sirens in france, i can film two sirens in one month

[Darley Champion]

Yeh, the Ully siren is indeed the same, minus the horns, it's looks almost like a smaller KMEurop, sans the horns, mounted on a metallic truss that hangs off the city hall's facade. Pretty unique mount if you ask me.

Re: the So4 - Nice find! I sent the seller a message, here's hoping he's willing to ship, if not, I'll bite the bullet and import one from the UK.

If you want a couple of other sirens, there's two or three I found.

The first one is in the old Collège in Clermont-de-l'Oise (I took a picture of it on this board), I couldn't identify what model it is, but it's huge and looks very recent.

Second and third ones are in Nogent-sur-Oise, the first one is atop a tall building (near the city hall), the other is on a private property and isn't visible, I have a very poor picture of it but it sure looks like a Chollet/early Cicca. (or it could be an air vent)

There's another one in Chambly behind the city hall, couldn't identify that one as well, as far as I know, both Clermont and Chambly sirens are dormant.

The Nogent 1 siren is active (and still tests!) but the second one is seemingly disconnected, or maybe as I said it's maybe not a siren at all.

[Dorianelevator]

Yeh, the Ully siren is indeed the same, minus the horns, it's looks almost like a smaller KMEurop, sans the horns, mounted on a metallic truss that hangs off the city hall's facade. Pretty unique mount if you ask me.

Re: the So4 - Nice find! I sent the seller a message, here's hoping he's willing to ship, if not, I'll bite the bullet and import one from the UK.

If you want a couple of other sirens, there's two or three I found.

The first one is in the old Collège in Clermont-de-l'Oise (I took a picture of it on this board), I couldn't identify what model it is, but it's huge and looks very recent.

Second and third ones are in Nogent-sur-Oise, the first one is atop a tall building (near the city hall), the other is on a private property and isn't visible, I have a very poor picture of it but it sure looks like a Chollet/early Cicca. (or it could be an air vent)

There's another one in Chambly behind the city hall, couldn't identify that one as well, as far as I know, both Clermont and Chambly sirens are dormant.

The Nogent 1 siren is active (and still tests!) but the second one is seemingly disconnected, or maybe as I said it's maybe not a siren at all.

about those, sadly i dont live near them. i live in the PACA region of France close to Brignoles (i dont live there tho, but as i said earlier i used to live in Barjols), atleast there are some weird sirens close to me. one of these being the Entrecasteaux siren that tests on fridays instead of wednesdays. i have absolutely no clue why and it only does a short blast. its on top of the city hall and is definitely a CEN siren. i also recorded it today, here is the video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gclXctaRuxw apart from that tho, the other most intresting siren next to me is as i said the one in Régusse that does not have the standard port ration and has missing horns, its definitely weird and looks like this : https://www.google.fr/maps/place/Mairie ... ?entry=ttu and finally there is a very weird 4 horn one up in Videauban that im gonna film for the first wednesday of april, what about march's first wednesday ? thats right, im gonna film the Régusse one. and thats kind of all i have to say. so now you know.

[Darley Champion]

I'm on the opposite side, Oise near Chantilly, finding a siren that still tests there is... to say the least, tough.

Far as I know Nogent-sur-Oise still tests theirs, Verneuil (pre-replacement) did as well, my hometown's siren had its control box ripped apart (or at least that's what I heard from a friend who has connections with the "services techniques municipaux"), Chantilly has two sirens, one atop a tower block on the Avenue de Sylvie, the other on the Rue du Connétable (which is said to be broken?)... The list is super long.

Closest to me are Lamorlaye Chantilly, Saint-Leu-d'Esserent, Boran-sur-Oise (yet another KMEurop/KMSecur 1kW) and of course my hometown's siren that I can literally see from my room (I kid you not! One day while I was taking a shower, the siren in question fired up out of the blue, scared the living out of me!), but all five (counting Chantilly's two sirens) are dormant. I miss those "first Wednesday of the month" tests.

There is also Precy-sur-Oise's fire dept. siren, I believe it's a KMEurop of the same ilk as the Gouvieux, 1kW with the tall "cage a écureuil" on the bottom, I never heard it the few times.


I have some family in southern France, and where they live (Var) I did spot a siren, but for the life of me, I couldn't say where it was, my memory is failing me on this. I just remember it may have had 10 ports, give or take.


To recenter the topic a bit, (sorry!) I believe Liancourt might have a Cicca siren hiding somewhere, not at the fire department, but rather on a HLM tower block, unfortunately it's invisible on StreetView given how high it is.

[Darley Champion]

By the way, before I forget, lemme drop a couple of GMaps links, there's the other Liancourt siren, on the SDIS-60 building:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/iXtSWdkwMazLm5Tv9

And the Ully-saint-Georges' CEN "Sans-Pavillons" siren:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/oPQiTog8o1xqsobA8

Alternative angle:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/1v9ncHNhGNMfbj1b6

One last before I go, the Boran-sur-Oise siren, located on the municipal library:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/hcPCfRUWvBsJPVqG7

I couldn't find my screenshots that I had made, so that'll do, I hope.

I'll keep you updated on the Klaxon SO-4 saga as well

Edit:

Some extra ones before I go, Angicourt also has (had?) a CEN siren, hiding in the city hall belfry under the bell:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/WMF5c3J1vSdJxj6t9

Laigneville's oddball siren, I don't know if it's a 10-port unit, but it sure does look like the old Verneuil siren:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/WMF5c3J1vSdJxj6t9

Here's another weird one in Montataire, 10 ports from the looks of it as well as a cone hat? That screams Cicca to me...

https://maps.app.goo.gl/uenUy8nBc9AuTEwr9